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RE: Ask a photographer #AAP
i remember your first post of this theme.
i hope that some people who are using cameras in daily or weekly manner will write their points of view of why photography topic is such silent here on Hive. I was really surprised a few weeks ago when i got 1200 likes on one of my images-posts but only 7 comments - all the comments were from my conversation with my friend, great photographer from Italy.
Nothing more. Personally i don't think that this place is suitable for photographers - whatever amateurs or professional. This place is literally made for gaining crypto for whatever one is doing. Nobody cares.
Almost nobody reads. To learn photography from rare random feedbacks just impossible.
I stopped putting my best photographs here due to feeling of the neglect to photography on this platform and debasement of the Artistic value of our Art.
I'm really sorry for my pessimism and disbelief in the future for photography here. It's why I was leaving this place already few times. And every time when i returned to see that something positive happened here, i was hardly disappointed again and again. It's only getting worse.
My Analog photography community, created especially for the "old school" photography on film, which should have generated interest in photography circles, never got an interest of the fat and lazy slipping whales managing the direction of the popularity and the earnings in this place.
i mention here a few amazing (by my opinion and my personal taste) photographers i met here and follow their posts every single day. Sure that part of them encountered the same problem of the deep indifference. Maybe they will have some idea how to make this place more respectful to Artists (photographers in our case) and not only the m0n0mad images will get some more attention, but also not always.
@jlinaresp @coloneljethro @barbarabezina @tonyz @castleberry @photofeed @neuerko @malos10 @photocuration @visualshots @lightcaptured @tattoodjay @careassaktart @abelfotografia @nenio @laimagenhabla @dimascastillo90 @harveyword @azwar.ipank @xaviduran @wilfredocav @tikotiko @x-rain @cryptoreforma @grafvisionsp @abelfotografia @barnabo73 (of course, no pressure to discuss here my friends !!! ).
I see HIVE as an alternative to stock photography sites, and with many more advantages, because in each post I "sell" images that are still mine and I receive a payment, let's say instantaneous, without having to upload beyond 1920px with 100ppi resolution. Since the cost of living in my country Cuba is much cheaper than in other more developed places, taking out 60hbd per month covers part of my expenses. In the three years I have been here, I bought a PC and feed my family today, all thanks to HIVE. On the other hand, this here is identical to a social network, whoever has a whale on their side has the great advantage that this has a monetary impact on their content, be it good, average, bad, mediocre or terrible. It hurts me to see colleagues with excellent photos earn just pennies when other users with less talent earn a lot with a review of a third-rate coffee shop, with bad texts and terrible visual coverage, but that's how it is. I accepted that reality a long time ago, and I focus on my photos, with the best possible quality, with a brief story, whether real or fictitious, and with that I paddle in these waters. In shutterstock, Adobe stock and Getty I have made about 280 dollars in 3 years, with many obstacles because I live in a country restricted by all kinds of blockades. So I did my math and here I am.
I enjoyed reading your vision. ๐ You do your maths very well indeed and have in your favour your talent as a photographer, your perseverance and your focus.
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It's nice to see that Hive is a source of income for some people. That makes the lack of comments more irrelevant for some.
Thanks for joining the discussion.
It's important to remember that a whale of 500k HP for example is the same as 1000 users with 5k HP each. I'm only making this point because my curation project for instance focuses on distributing hive inflation daily to deserving authors but we can't "force" them to hold onto some hive power for their own use. Many decide to sell everything (instead of say only the HBD) or just leave after a while instead of combining their efforts to get a post to some good rewards together instead of having to rely on "whales" who haven't sold their hive or bought more.
I agree with the rest of your comment, though, hive's a social media platform so it's not enough to just share your photos and expect rewards, you gotta go out there and build connections as well.
This is why we need more users and consumers/curators and preferably those who don't have to sell everything they earn. If we had 100x more users and naturally a bit higher price a lot of authors who only focus on creating could make better rewards in terms of $ value without having to rely on whales/curation projects.
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i'm glad that this platform is working for you perfectly. especially when there are blockaded and i can't get why these blockades are still exists.
Ha, I'm paddling with you! Did the math and decided hive was going to do better than stock, have debated going expat and wandering places where I can live on my HBD.
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This blog is going in another direction than I had suspected, but I think it's a good discussion @victorbz
The 'problem' is broader than photography alone I think. In the PeakD interface you can get an overview of the number of (unique) visitors of your posts and for mine that isn't a lot. You can also see the amount of time on average users spent on your post. Both are quite low for most of my posts although some have quite some upvotes.
This indeed stimulates people to just make their blogs and don't interact.
I was hoping that this initiative could at least change this a little bit.
indeed, i took the discussion a little bit to different direction, but i think that the themes are connected.
when people here will be interesting to conversate in the posts in the whole community, this will affect also your specific theme about photography and the feedback for the photographers.
and i don't need the graphs of the PeakD to know that when i have a few hundreds likes after the curie like, these people just voted automatically, no one from them is really using this platform for communication. So sad.
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I truly understand your reflection on all of this, and the world of photography still suffers from great prejudice, a great lack of visibility in all niches. The secret is to focus on your best, and never give up, because the secret to success is persistence! Thank you for mentioning my profile in this report, and for liking my photographic work. Stay strong my friend, together we are strong!!! @victorbz
thank you for the kind words !
I understand what you are talking about, there is a row of problems on Hive. But I don't see alternatives to Hive.
These likes are mostly from the curation trail, not real viewers, so not so many comments go with these 1200 likes.
But likes are not quite a real thing on every platform. Let's say a couple of posts of mine got 200 likes each on Reddit recently. But why do I need these clicks of half-sleeping scrolling minds of random people who looked at my work for a quarter of a second and decided "okay"?
In some ways, yes. While other platforms are made for gaining likes for whatever one is doing. Likes are a simulacrum or recognition. While crypto (along with real connection with people) is a tool to change things around you (like any sort of money).
Instagram, for example, gives hope that, one day, you'll reach a broader audience. In exchange, you work for IG for years. So many amazing photographers are serious about IG and have only 2000-3000 subs with 30-100 like for a post. They say "oh, that's just my blog, that's just a habit" but actually their creativity is oppressed by Instagram's cult of "look how many subs/likes I got". Moreover, likes on IG deforms your creativity: crowds have preferences and you need to follow them if you want to reach the mentioned broader audience. So, some people add a dose of vulgarity to their images and get... 50 more likes for each post, lol.
It's a problem everywhere to get a lot of constructive feedback - there are usually few comments below beautiful photographs, and most comments are of "love it/amazing" type. On Hive, I sometimes get feedback from photographers I do respect, and I am happy with it.
We need more people (photographers) on Hive. I believe we need more niche photography communities on Hive - photographers usually want to join like-minded communities like street photography, wildlife photography. And we probably need large yearly niche photography contests with prize funds to spread the word on the internet about Hive. And we need real-life exhibitions. If we have HiveFest, why can't we have a HiveExhibition? HiveExhibition can be part of the next HiveFest, for example.
...In the 2010s, people could want a new social media to connect with friends or to look at images of random people. In the 2020s, people are fully packed with internet activities. People not only don't want another social media, they abandon accounts on major social media and focus on family and close friends to talk on messengers to share thoughts and shots. In the 2020s, people need not classical social media but internet tools. A community of like-minded photographers with large contests and exhibitions is a tool for a photographer.
P.S. bolded some thoughts for too-long-to-read people.
thank you for participating. i fed all of these and to say you honestly, i'm also tired of these. MySpace, Flickr, DeviantArt, Google+, FB, IG, of course Twitter, Threads, some photo sharing apps, now the new and promising FOTOAPP. And of course Hive already for a long time. There is no end to the list, but also most of these already died or forgotten.
The idea about HiveExhibition is very interesting, because i believe that looking on printed photographs is much more useful spending of time than scrolling endless feeds.
Thanks for your contribution.
From my own experience I can tell that maintaining a community is a lot of work. And it takes a lot of work to attract the Hivers to your niche community. But I do agree that it would be a good thing.
I like this idea. This could attract some photographers from outside if you promote it well. Maybe you should even make it a monthly one. But you do need sponsoring for this.
This is actually my first blogpost that has received so many constructive comments. It's good to see people do want change...
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Thanks for the mention this past few months I have been pretty slack with commenting but trying to pick that up now
of course no pressure my friend. ๐๐๐
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You have some point. Often it happened to me that I have made a big effort in writing huge articles accompanied with my photos for which I always try to be as great as possible but getting very little feedback and sometimes not even a lot votes and also just a bit of crypto.
Still I like how this blog is made cause through it I can also promote my work in blog-photoessay form by sharing it on the other social networks.
I've seen recently how monomad community is growing & gaining attention & was so happy about.
I still believe that here are too less participants who can really write a criticism in comment or express any opinion on photo-art subject.
I stopped hopping about that. I prefer when some of photographers who really have some work to show, sometimes better than mine, write me a comment.
Anyway I believe it's still worthy to participate in here cause of the multiple purposes.
Thanks for mentioning me! It feels good to be here in this company.
Thanks for your comment.
I don't know if I agree with that statement. I see myself as a photography enthusiast and there are many better photographers here on Hive. But I can express my opinion about a serie of photos.
I hope we can create a change....
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huge thank you for the participation to the conversation.
i hope for the best also inside of this platform :-)
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Your reflection is important and is transversal to other areas of HIVE.
Fortunately, there are people who want a change, an evolution that is healthier for those who create content and for those who support it.
Honestly, I'm not against whales. The whales want to make money because they have invested, they want a return. It doesn't matter how. It's legitimate, even if we don't agree with it.
What we see today is something that is not healthy. That's my opinion. I know a lot of photographers who I could invite to HIVE. I'm not doing it now because they wouldn't understand. They wouldn't like the โinjusticeโ and it's hard to come up with arguments to defend the current state of affairs.
Obviously, I've felt like giving up. But the reasons I have for giving up are exactly the same as those that keep me going.
There's a teaching from my late father that always stays with me: โDon't waste your energy trying to end the bad world. Create your own good world!โ.
That's what I'm working on. I don't want to end up with what is. I don't even whine and waste energy thinking about it anymore. I transmute that energy, that anger (to make it clearer), to help build another parallel universe within HIVE.
I want to bring new photographers to HIVE. I want physical photography galleries represented on HIVE to seek out work that is published here. I want photography magazines inside to recruit work that is published on HIVE. I want external photographic organizations joining HIVE to โtakeโ content produced here. I want to see online training paid for with HIVE or HBD.
HIVE needs to open up to the outside world.
In addition to the existing rewards through votes, HIVE photographers deserve recognition outside the ecosystem too.
To that end, I'm building a project to share with someone who I'm sure will help create a parallel world to this one.
I'm keen to emphasize: I don't want to do away with what's there! I want to help build something new!
The decentralization of this blockchain, combined with the tools it has, allows me to dream.
I believe there will be room for all worlds to coexist in the HIVE universe.
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Thank you for your very wide comment
The "injustice" is exist on every platform - IG and FB everything is affected just by different techniques.
and i agree with your father's words.
I tried to bring here a few friends photographers and not only photographers, but without any success, most of them gave up almost immediately, but some got some kind of success when got the "rules" of the "game".
Now i can't wait to read about your new project :-) !
!LUV
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Hi - @friendlymoose thank you for providing this chance to say an opinion and @victorbz thank you for your appreciation.
I too think there is a lot of quality content here in Hive without the reciprocal rewards. I myself have been member of this platform for many years - since 2016, that is almost 8 years, but with some breaks because I had severe health issues. And every time I returned to Hive I felt I was punished for my absence. I can't really prove it but it's a feeling. I think that I am trying and trying and I don't receive proper comments, appreciation, or just criticism. Again, I can't prove it but it is more like a feeling.
Post 4 surgeries, a cancer, a severe autoimmune that destroys my quality of living for years, sometimes I feel someone is pointing a finger at me... (ohh I miss onceuponatime - we had great discussions!)
On the other hand I see great content and appreciation to people which is encouraging. For others!
thank you for taking a part in this conversation. hope you are feeling better these days !
sure that Hive is not punishing you but just not appreciate your publications as they should be. but i really understand the feeling
I've been following the performances of the photographic communities. Two months separate these two pieces of data. I'll do another one in December and by the middle of 2025 I'll have enough material for more objective conclusions.
However, this curiosity stands out: all of them (with the exception of one) have increased their number of subscribers, but most of them have decreased their active users, interactions and pending rewards. Curious ๐
It's too early to draw conclusions, but it's worth noting that one of them absorbs more pending rewards than all the others. The second largest absorbs all the others.
That's why the flow of curators and content authors to these communities is natural. It's legitimate, we can't condemn attending where we are. Nor can we see those who act like this as enemies. The whales and they are doing what they want, money. That's their goal.
I respect that, but I'm not going there. If the ecosystem allows for other realities, then let's focus on creating something better. Only with transparency, justice, recognition, gratitude and decentralization can we attract new bees. Behind the bees will come whales.
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I don't really understand your comments about "the whales want money", it almost doesn't really matter what people vote on as close to no downvotes occur, so they could vote on pretty much anything and the returns in hive would stay the same, so not really sure what you think the whales are doing that enriches them in exchange for not supporting content creators.
When it comes to the communities, one of them is incubated in the OCD program and was recently handed over to a curator who is still active after the previous owner left Hive. You're correct when you say the data is still too small to draw conclusions, especially since the price of Hive has been going down these past few months which may affect the decline in active users in the other communities. You are also correct to assume that the photography community may be "absorbing" activity from other ones because of our active curator in our incubation being able to reward those posting there well. We are however just one curation project on Hive so it doesn't mean the others can't do well only based on if they're incubated in our program or not. I think there's 200 million Hive staked currently with us using 6 million of it + some autovotes on our trail, that's less than 5% effect on the rewardpool.
The reason we don't have other photo communities incubated is because we're trying to only incubate one niche community at a time to allow for others to join that aren't already incubated. The same reason we only have one Gaming community incubated.
Other factors that could result in the decrease in activity in the other communities aside from Hive price are things like the community creator not being active, it not having helpers/engagement/curators casting their votes to authors sharing content there. This is an issue with the way communities are, where the creator is the owner of that account and if they go away the community is left to people who can't control it unless they're also given some of the keys. We've had this happen a few times in the past but we didn't want to step in and create communities of our own to prevent centralization even if it meant a longer lifespan for those communities.
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Thank you for this investigation. It's interesting to see all these in one table.
about the "pending rewards" - it's not some additional feature of the communities but the sum of all
ongoing rewards made by the last week publishers to the community and how they were rewarded by the whales, supporting the community hosts. like qurator peakd for the m0n0mad for example.
Don't be wrong, there is no special "pending rewards" coming from HIVE only from the whales connected to the community hosts (the chain, protection whatever) so they votes for their interests as well. You can check the trading posts of every community and to see the "supporting" whale. "appreciator" "resonator" "curatorhulk" "blocktrades" and others
Seems like curie and ocd are less involved and more "fair" but can't say what is moving them.
A lot of interaction comes from how far you interact with the community here for yourself. If one just dumps photos and does not incentivize comments by upvoting, replying, appreciating and if one does not comment on other peopleยดs post, he will not get too much attention. But of course this is time-consuming and requires patience. Also to have a stake here helps, too. If a photographer is embedded in a (local) community, this is of course better, too.
exactly what is about the original post - communication between people and not only votes gaining process :-)